If you’re wanting to drastically improve the results in your business from your time, energy and money spent on marketing and social media, you need this episode.  Learn why people are not seeing or listening to your Social Media posts and practical tips to change the marketing game in your business. 


  • The importance of knowing your ideal customer Avatar.
  • Identifying exactly who your most profitable customers really are.
  • Why you need to do this important framework before you start writing your copy and advertising.
  • How to start defining your customer Avatar.
  • Why you need to be constantly refining your customer Avatar.
  • Why you need to get an extremely deep understanding of everything about them. 
  • The importance of truly understanding their pain points and why this is important.
  • How to find this important information.
  • What to do if you have multiple ideal customer Avatars.



G’day, g’day, and welcome to the ‘Business Made Easy Podcast’, where we make business
easy. I’m your host Jason Skinner and I am thrilled that you are with me for another week
where we navigate this crazy thing we call business and entrepreneurship. I don’t know
about you, but it really can be a challenging time out there in business, when you’re juggling
so many hats.
When you start out in business, you start out with this grand vision of working for yourself
and you’re gonna have a better life, and more free time, and less stress, and more money in
the bank. Usually all common motivators that people go into business and start business for
themselves, but quite quickly into the journey, once we start putting on staff, or having cash
flow issues, or customers needing extra attention, or things just don’t seem to be as rosy as
what we first set out to do.
We’re wearing multiple hats. As a business owner and entrepreneur, we’re always wearing
multiple hats. That’s really important to recognise and understand, and not beat yourself up
over really, because it is a big role that you’re taking on when you take on business for
The podcast is all about helping you to navigate that maze, and helping you to give you
tools, and techniques, and tips, to help you to I guess deal with those things, and make
things more efficient, and life a lot better for you, and hopefully put some more money in the
bank account for you as well. That’s what we want to do.
That’s what my role and profession is all about doing as well. I love bringing you this
podcast. I love helping you to grow your business, so thank you for joining me today. Thank
you if you are new to the show, for tuning in. Please be sure to hit the subscribe button, if
you haven’t already done so, and that will ensure that you get each weekly episode as it
comes out, straight to your listening device of choice.
Thanks for joining me. For everybody, whatever you’re doing I hope it is fun, and you’re
enjoying yourself, whether you’re at the gym or out on a run, driving to work, or you may be
just tuning in at home, kicking back for a bit. Thanks for being here.
I’ve just got back from a whirlwind trip to the States. I’ve been over there for ‘Trafficking
Conversion Summit’, and also ‘Social Media Marketing World’. It really was quite a rush trip.
I landed probably two days before the conference. Had a couple of days to check out San
Diego, which is an absolutely beautiful part of the world. And then I had the conference for a
week and straight on the plane the next day, and home and into it.
Yeah. It’s been quite a whirlwind. I’ll be bringing you tips and new information that I’ve learnt
over there, that I think will help you in your business as well, because there’s a lot of exciting
things on the horizon in terms of social media marketing, and traffic, and way the internet’s
going. I really want to make sure that you’re at the forefront of that for your business as well.
Without further ado, let’s get into it. Now today, we are going to talk about probably one of
the most important … Not probably, actually what I think is one of the most important things
that you could do in your business, to make sure you give yourself every possible chance to
maximise the growth of your business, that is the understanding of your ideal customer
avatar, or some people call it your ideal customer persona.
The personality that the ins and outs of your ideal customer. The reason why this is so, so
important, particularly in the current environment, and more important going forward as well,
is that the customer now is more informed than they have ever been before in the history of
man, because they have this thing called ‘Google’. They have these things called smart
phones, and they have location settings, they have an ability, they have every conceivable
bit of data that they need to inform themselves of their buying, or whatever it is that they’re
wanting to buy.
If you take someone who’s looking to buy a television, they can virtually sit at home, do all
their research, look at what they need, and they can even get directions to the nearest store,
because ‘Google’ knows their location and knows the location of the stores that they’re
looking at and searching for, so they can get directions.
They can know price comparisons, they can know features, they can know all about it. When
they come into that store to buy that TV, they know bang, it’s in and done. And in a lot of
cases now too, more and more this is going, is the ability to just order it online and have it
sent to you.
The customer is informed. It’s not like they have to go and talk to somebody now to buy
something. They can just look it up. It’s really a no-brainer. What that means for you as a
business owner, is that you really know or need to know, of the most profitable people that
you’re looking for, your ideal customer, what it is that they’re searching, what it is that they
need. What do they want? When do they want it? How do they want it? How do they want to
be spoken to? What language are they talking?
We’re gonna cover all that today. I think you’ll get to see the importance of what I’m talking
about here, is because if let’s just say for instance, your ideal profitable customer only wants
to buy things online, and only wants to talk via email, yet you have employed a call centre to
ring them every Friday night to talk about your product or service.
There’s a real mismatch there between what your customer’s needs are and the way they
like to be treated, and how you are actually treating them. As we go, the world’s a very, very
competitive place now. The customer, as I said, is informed, and they really call t
today to set you up I guess, as best as possible, to be able to give you every chance to win
that game.
It does start by knowing who your most profitable customer is. If you go back to episode 23,
this is mainly for existing businesses, if you go back to episode 23, we worked through an
exercise to identify who your most profitable customers are. You can get to that by going to . But if you go back and work through
those exercises if you haven’t done so already, that will help you if you’re an existing
business, whether online or offline. That will help you to identify who your most profitable
existing customers are.
If you’re new to business, don’t stress. This still applies to you, and still very important, but I
just wanted to position that I guess. That is the only variation I guess, if you’ve got an
existing business, you really want to make sure you’ve gone through your existing customers
to identify where they’re at, or who the most profitable ones are, and can be.
But for a new business, then you can still work through this, you’re just gonna have to do a
little bit more investigation, a little bit more work. But I’ll help you along the way with that as
we go. What we want to do here is get really, really granular, and get a specific
understanding of our customers so that we can better relate to them, and better speak their
When they are searching, and when they are researching, and when they are looking for
things, we’re coming up and we’re talking to them. They are hearing us loud and clear. We’re
listening to them. It’s a person-to-person relationship now. Not just a, “Hey we’ve got a
business. We’ve got these TVs and you need them, so come to us,” because if you want to
go down that path, that’s not gonna work real well.
What we’re gonna be doing in this exercise, at the end of this exercise is being able to have
enough information so we know everything there is to know about our ideal profitable
customer, because what that does is that shapes then, all our marketing messages.
Everything from our copywriting, the words we put on our website. It’s no good building a
website for a plumber and filling it full of jargon that a lawyer would use. I mean, the person
needing plumbing services gets to the website, and it all sounds all legally and legal jargon.
There’s a real mismatch there. We want to make sure, and this exercise is gonna help you to
identify exactly who that is.
It’s really important we do this too, because we don’t want to annoy our customer. We don’t
want to turn them off our business or brand. We want to welcome them with open arms.
When they’re looking we want them to say, “Hey these people get me. I’m gonna go to them
because these other people over here don’t.” You can get an idea of the game. That’s why
we’re working on this, we want to identify this avatar.
It is the starting point in your marketing journey. If you go out there, and this is why a lot of
people are having trouble with social media, for instance, and Facebook, and they’re going,
“Look, Facebook ads don’t work.” Well, it’s not that Facebook ads don’t work, maybe your
messaging isn’t talking to the right people. Or the people that you’re trying to get is not
matching up with your message, and they’re not resonating or relating to it.
By going through this exercise first, before you go and spend money on advertising, before
you start doing your copywriting and all those things, you’ll have a framework after today, to
help you position your business and position that message in the right way.
The starting point with, I guess the customer avatar or the customer persona, is that we want
to look at a few key things. Now, the better you do this, and the deeper you dig, and the
more you get to know about your customer, the better the results are that you are going to
get in the long-run, with your marketing and with all your branding, and sales, etc.
A point with this too is that it’s an ever changing document this, because the environment is
continually changing. Customer’s needs are changing all the time. Technology’s changing
and dictating a lot of the change. It should be a live document, this avatar worksheet,
because as needs change and demographics change, and things change, you want to be
making sure that you’re keeping up.
That’s why talking with your customers if you’re an existing business, talking with your
customer is a really, really important thing to do, because that’s how you learn. You learn
what’s driving them, what pain points, etc., they’re having.
The critical areas of a customer avatar, if you like, I call it an avatar. Some people call it
persona, whatever works for you. There are a number of different words for it. I’ll call it an
avatar for the sake of this exercise.
The things that we’re looking for, we want to look at the demographics of our customer, our
ideal customer. What’s their age group? What’s typically the age group of someone who we
would ideally like to serve?
Their marital status. Are they married? Single? Divorced? For a divorce lawyer, the marital
status is going to be, their ideal customer is someone who’s looking to get divorced, so
currently married and unhappy. They’re not gonna go hanging around looking for singles, are
they? You get the picture with why those sorts of things are important.
Occupation. What do they do for a living? Are they in a professional occupation? Or are they
a trade occupation? Or are they an online business? Offline business? What specifically do
they do? Are they self-employed entrepreneurs? We want to know their occupation.
The sex. Are they male or female? Maybe it doesn’t matter. These are sorts of questions and
facts that you want to sit down, I guess, and identify. Other things we want to look at then,
are the psychographics of our customer. What are their attitudes, their behaviours, their
values? What do they value? Are they particularly religious? What sort of language and
communication do they like? We’re looking here in the psychographic area, and I’ve got a list
of these too. I’ll put it on the website, which you’ll be able to get at . We want to look at all the psychographic
elements of our customer.
The geographics. Where do they live? Are they in a particular country? Are they in a
particular state, or town, or city? You might be only targeting really local businesses, like for
a restaurant, for a local restaurant, or a hairdresser. You may be only targeting a really
defined, specific region, or area. You want to get that down and really drill down where your
customer lives, and where do they work?
You might be targeting the work arena as well. Demographics, psychographics, and then
geographics. Then we want to look at the behaviours of our ideal customer avatar. What
sources of information do they consume? Where do they read their information? Where do
they do their research? Are they on Google Chrome? Do they subscribe to the financial
newspapers? Do they read magazines? What magazines do they read?
If you’re targeting a particular hobbyist in fly fishing, it’s no good advertising over in a lawn
bowls magazine, for want of a better example. But you get the drift there. We want to start
really drilling down on where our ideal customer’s absorbing information.
Then what pains and objections do they have? What sorts of things are really frustrating
them? What’s keeping them up at night? This is a really, really important one, because if you
clearly know the pains and objections that your customer, your ideal most profitable
customer is having, well guess what, you can now shape your product or service, or
marketing message to say, “Hey, I know that you have these pains and objections. I have
this way to take those pains and objections away. Would you like to talk about that?”
All of a sudden, there’s a match. There’s a match between your marketing and your
business, and your ideal customer’s needs. I hope you get the point there with this, as to
how I guess your ideal customer can easily marry up to what it is. You’re talking their
language. You’re actually speaking with them. Some of the things under the behaviour
category, just to give you an illustration … Actually I’ll just go back one bit.
If we go back to the demographic for instance, when we’re talking demographic, we want to
look at age, gender, country of birth, nationality, race, height, weight. Someone in the weight
loss industry would really want to know exactly what weight, you’d be looking for certain
people over a certain weight, that had a pain and objection, which was difficulty losing
weight. You get the idea, that when we sit down and break up these and understand these
needs, we can really get granular and specific about how we can best help you with our
product and service.
In the geographic area, we’re looking at the climate even can be a factor. No good selling
board shorts and a surfboard to someone who lives up in the snow. You just not gonna go
there with your advertising, or your marketing message. The way Facebook is now too, it
really can drill down, someone was telling me the other day, there’s something like over 2
million data points that Facebook has on any particular … Facebook know more about you
and I, then you and I know about ourselves. That came out at the conference the other day.
This exercise really is designed to help you get specific, and understand these things, before
you go and put pen to paper, in terms of spending dollars, or wasting money on Facebook
ads, and marketing as well. When we’re looking at … What are some of the other ones here.
I’ve got behaviour. When we’re looking at behaviour, we’re looking at what social channels
do they mainly hang around? One type of customer is gonna hang around on a certain type
of platform, social platform, as opposed to another.
One might be on Instagram. There might be a lot of craft lovers are on Pinterest. If you’re in
the craft-loving market, it’s no good going in advertising on LinkedIn, or putting all your
content into LinkedIn, or into Twitter, because craft lovers are looking at Pinterest and
Instagram type stuff. That’s the gist I’m getting at with when we’re talking about these
It really is important that we drill down and get the best out of them. I’ve got some
worksheets to help you with this exercise. When we do this, we want to make sure that we
don’t just skim over things, because don’t go, “Ah I don’t need to worry about that. I won’t
worry about that.” Work through them all. Identify all of them. Brainstorm as many as you
can, because as I said, situations are changing all the time, and technology’s changing all
the time, and customer needs are changing all the time.
The better you understand your customer, the better you’re gonna be able to talk to them,
and the more value you’re going to be able to provide them, so it’s so, so important that you
get quite granular with that.
As I say, I’ve got a worksheet here, which I’m gonna put in the show notes for you. It’s under . That will help you to work through what
we’re talking about here today. Now the question that probably comes to mind is, well where
do I find this information? Particularly if you haven’t got an existing customer base. If you
haven’t got an existing customer … Well we’ll deal with if you do have an existing customer
base, best thing that you can do is talk with them.
As they come in, “What brings you in here today? Whereabouts do you live?” You can ask
them those questions. You can look at addresses on your database. You can look for age.
I’m in the business advisory space, so I usually know roughly the age factors of my clients,
and I know roughly what age group they fit into, because it’s no good talking to all my clients
on SnapChat if none of them are on SnapChat and they’re all on Facebook or LinkedIn, or
whatever it is that they may be on. You get the gist there. Talking to your existing customers,
very, very important.
Surveying your existing customers. You can use programs like SurveyMonkey, which is a
free surveying tool. You can design a brief survey to say, “Hey look, you know, we want to
improve our services, and your experience with our business,” and then you could ask some
questions along those lines to build that out.
Another way to find information is Google itself. Google has a number of tools that a lot of
people aren’t aware of. There’s Google Survey. Google News, so you can get really, really
specific with Google as to the types of news and information that you start to drill down.
Google Trends is another one as well. I’ll put links to these in the show notes for you. Google
Trends will show you the trends, the content that’s trending for particular topics. If you type in
there, a topic into Google Trends, and then you can find out what’s trending at the moment
for that particular topic. It’s a really useful tool.
Trendsmap is another one. LinkedIn Pulse, so LinkedIn has I guess, like a newsfeed of
what’s trending in LinkedIn for particular topics as well, so you can check that out.
BuzzSumo, is a great tool, really good tool. There’s a free version and a paid version. But
the free version gives you enough information to get started, and it’ll show you exactly what’s
trending on particular topics for a particular subject that you’re looking for out there at the
moment. Really good program to use.
There’s another one, Wordtracker. There’s a couple of options there for you, if you don’t
know where to start. If you started just fishing around with that information, through any of
those programs, you would find a starting point to get you started, because a lot of people
don’t know where to start when they go, “Oh geez. I’m looking for, ideally want to look at
40-year-old fly fishing ladies that live in New Zealand. Well, where do I start looking?”
Well, you might go into Google Trends and type fly fishing New Zealand, ladies fly fishing,
something like that and see what’s trending around in there. I don’t know why I picked lady’s
fly fishing, but anyway I did so I got to work on my examples. I’m sorry.
There is a really good program as well called AnswerThePublic. It’s free to use right now. It’s
a really great tool for finding out what people are actually searching for on a particular topic.
If you go into AnswerThePublic, and you type in there a particular keyword that you’re
looking for, or a particular area, it will show you every single search on the internet for that
particular thing, what people are typing.
If you typed in lawn mowing, it would show you all the questions that are being asked around
lawn mowing. Where is the best place to do lawn mowing? How do you do lawn mowing? All
those sorts of things. It puts it in this really great cool logical formula for you, layout for you,
to show you exactly, easy to follow. It’s a free tool at the moment, and I’ll put a link to it in the
show notes, so go and check that out if you haven’t done so already.
You can go in there and do that, because it’s a really good useful tool to help you do your
research as well. I’m also gonna put a worksheet in the show notes for you, so you can go to
that worksheet, download it, and use that as your research plan to help you to do that.
Now, a question that may be coming across your mind is, “What if I’ve got more than one
customer avatar?” That’s quite possible. You know you’ve got multiple products in your
business, they’re not gonna be for everybody. What you’re gonna have is you’re gonna have
this situation where you might have a particular avatar over here that’s a 35-year-old female,
but over here it’s a 50-year-old surfing male.
It’s okay to have more than one avatar in your business. But the more specific you get with
this, the better you can target and position your advertising, and position your messaging to
that specific person. If you use that example I just had there of the 30-year-old female, you’re
gonna use a different language than the 50-year-old surfing male. It’s just gonna be a totally
different language.
I hope that you get what I’m talking about there. But as I said, I’m gonna put some templates
in the show notes for you. I’ll put them in there. They’re free to use. You can download them
and use them. I’m also gonna have a workshop on this. I’m gonna put a training together on
this, so if you’re interested in doing a training on this with me, just drop me an email to
[email protected] , and I’ll put together a training and make sure I
include you in the invitation when I put that training out, because it really is such an
important area of your business, that you get right from the outset, because it’s just gonna
save you so much pain.
You know yourself, if you’re willing to talk to a particular person for your own needs, if you go
into a business and someone talks to you in your language, that you understand, how much
nicer and easy that conversation goes, and how much more pleasant it is to deal with that
person or business. Think about that in reverse. Relationships going forward and now, start
that it is now, it’s not in the future, relationships and relationship marketing is the way. You
can only have great relationships when you’re really communicating effectively and to the
right people, at the right times, with the right messages. Can’t stress that enough for you in
your business.
All righty. That’s pretty well all I had time for today to cover with you. I really wanted to just
get you thinking about that customer avatar, and who is your customer avatar. If you do have
one, please feel free to drop me a line and tell me who they are. I’m happy to check what
you’ve got and make sure that it’s in line with what I’m talking about. If you need help with it
also, drop me a line, [email protected] . Happy to point you in the right
direction and get you started. I really just want people to take action on this, and I think you’ll
find that you’ll have a much, much more effective time with marketing and messaging, even
emails when you’re doing email campaigns, or sending emails out to these people. You’re
gonna use words and language that they understand and relate to, and it’s just a lot better
experience and a lot more effective.
All righty. I will leave it at that. If you haven’t joined our Facebook community yet, please
remember to do so. It’s free to join. It’s over there at . It’s a free community of entrepreneurs
and business owners that are all talking about business and helping and supporting each
other. We’ve got such a vast range of skills and expertise over there. They’re all helping
each other, and talking, and sharing in the community. That’s . If you go over there, I’ll be sure to let you
in and make sure that you’re all looked after.
All righty. That’s all I have time for today. I’m gonna leave you with this question, who is your
ideal customer avatar? Go and grab the worksheets, download them, fill them in, work on
them, and I will talk to you next week. Until next week I’m going to now hand you over to Mia,
and she’s gonna take us out. I will speak to you soon. Here’s to your success. Take us out
Mia. Bye.




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